Neil Macleod, the President elect of the South African Academy of Engineering, was in discussion with Prof Himla Soodyall, the EO of ASSAf on 17 May 2022. Mr Macleod is a civil engineer specializing in water and sanitation services and has spent 22 years as the head of the public water and sanitation utility that provides water and sanitation services to more than 3.7 million people in the Durban Metropolitan area. Mr Macleod explained that sanitation, which includes sewage treatment and solid waste disposal, has a positive side in that it is a valuable source of essential commodities which could become scarce in future. The discussion is available at